The Unknowns of Data Centers | Carson Combs on the Plain Values Podcast

How, how do you see the data centers themselves? I’ve, I’ve read stories, I’ve watched interviews of, you know, landowners who have decided to, you know, to basically say, “We’re gonna fight this whole thing, and we’re gonna try to not let these data centers come in here.” Mm-hmm. Um, are they as loud as what I’ve heard? Do, do they make a ton of noise? Do you… I mean, obviously they’re using a lot of resources. Mm-hmm. I was just gonna ask you a whole bunch of other questions. I- I’ll go back to j- just, just some so, you know, some possible misconceptions about what a data center actually does to a community. So again, like with everything in life, there’s no, like, simple, easy, cut-and-dry answer. Yeah. Um, it really depends on the, the data center and how it’s designed, um, whether they’re using cooling systems. Um, what I can tell you is that I have experience from a couple other jurisdictions in, in the Columbus area that are dealing, they’re grappling with that right now. Um, and so, like, one of the big issues in Hilliard that we had while I was there, uh, we kept getting complaints about noise. And so we would go out in the field, and it’s like we don’t hear anything. It’s like they must be talking about the, the humming from the high-tension power lines. And we kept getting calls over and over again, and what we ended up finding out, and we never actually heard it, but, um, one of the, one of the facilities there, um, you know, and this is back when we were still having tons of supply chain issues, you know- Oh, sure … when all the shipping was messed up. They couldn’t get certain components or parts in, and so their f- they didn’t have all their f- fan or venting systems in. And so it was generating this kind of low hum all the time. So people were hearing it at night, and it was keeping people up. So a- again, it’s one of those things where depending on the construction and, and how it was, you know, designed, every data center facility may have different kinds of issues along with it. And we don’t know enough about it, you know, at, at our level to say, you know, when something comes in, you know, “What’s gonna be the issue with this?” Mm-hmm. “And is it appropriate to be right next to residential or not?” Mm-hmm. And so that’s where I go back to zoning of the land i- is where it’s all set in stone. ‘Cause once you have the zoning that allows it, you know, there’s not much we can do about it. Right. Hilliard is a good example of where, uh, a particular company has, um, three different locations, uh, you know, basically data center- Real … developments with- within the municipality. Um, and the, the last one would, that was under construction, which is the largest, it’s like 150 acres, um, the key issue right now is, uh, power generation. So they went and got approval. It, it was already zoned. And, and so everything goes back to zoning, uh, and what the land is allowed to be used for. Mm-hmm. So in the instance of the county where, where I’m at now, it, it goes back to the town, individual townships. It’s like, “What is in your comprehensive plan, and is that being translated through your zoning code?” Which actually spells out what you can and can’t do with the land. Uh, and in some cases, you know, the townships clearly do not want that kind of development, and so we’re seeing some of the townships, uh, zone that out of, out of the permitted uses right now, and that’s their choice, you know, as, as the zoning authority. But it really depends. And so in the case of this project in Hilliard, um, it already had, uh, manufacturing or industrial zoning in place, so we really couldn’t say, “You can’t do it.” You know- Right … there’s a zone for it, but it’s adjacent to residential. Uh, and so they started, uh, constructing the project, uh, with the full understanding that, um, there wasn’t enough power to run all of it. They- They knew. Oh, yeah. They knew. They knew it. They knew going into it, and, um, American Electric Power came out and said, “Yeah, we’re not gonna have power available to run all of this for seven to 10 years at least.” Um, and so that’s, that’s in the news cycle right now. Um, so what they’re looking at, uh, currently is, um, different kinds of, uh, options, uh, to actually power all those. Solar and wind? I mean, are, is that- No … the direction they’re going? No, actually- Or is it something totally different? … the, the, the key things that have been coming up right now, um… So in Hilliard, they’re having a huge discussion over fuel cell technology. Um, so they’re looking at, uh, putting in basically these fuel cells, um, that use chemical reaction to generate electricity through natural gas. So it’s not nuclear? No, that’s, that’s a whole ‘nother thing that is potentially out there. So, you know, package nuclear plants, you know, like what, what they’ve been using to, to run, you know, our aircraft carriers and things like that- Right … for ships for a long time. So having a small power plant on site. Um, the third thing that’s, um, being implemented right now is the, the natural gas power plant. So building a full plant that basically is fueled through natural gas to generate electricity. And so all three of those things are being tossed around right now. Um, not, not just the Columbus area but, you know, across the state- Mm-hmm … depending on the location. Um, but then those kind of things without- Fully understanding how those work, you know, sure, I’m, as a landowner, I’m gonna be concerned. A-and, and that’s why when you, when you have something in front of a public body, you know, sure, everybody’s gonna come out of the woodwork because the worst thing that you can have is the unknown. And it’s like if, if the, you know, if people, you know, whether it’s the companies that are building or the state agencies, if, if they’re not fully explaining how this works and what the ramifications are- Mm-hmm … it’s like absolutely people are gonna oppose it, and I, I don’t blame them. Um- Yeah … uh, we’re actually, you know, personally kind of in the same boat because we have a, a new data center development that’ll probably be under construction here before long, you know, down the road from where we live, and we have the same questions. It’s like, how’s this gonna impact our groundwater? You know, we, you always think, you know, w- Ohio has tons of water. We’ve never had to worry about water before, and what we’re now hearing is that, you know, at some point in the future, and I can’t give you the exact, you know, number of years out, but clearly within our lifetime, w-we may be looking at, you know, a case of where we don’t have enough groundwater to facilitate or support agriculture activities. Really? Yeah. So it’s, it’s, it’s a huge issue and, and they’re really starting to look at it in detail for the first time. Um, a-and I don’t know if, if that aquifer, ’cause, you know, there’s multiple aquifers around the region, b-but I don’t, I don’t know where they’re at on specific studies. But, you know, in general for the whole region, yeah, we’re, we’re definitely looking at water problems down the future. You know, if you think California is a foreign thing, you know, who knows? It, it may not be that crazy to see some of that here in the future the way things are going. A friend of mine lives, you know, down Newark and Granville area, and the last time that, that, that we were talking, he said, he said, “Marlin,” he said, “You need to understand one data center” … And I’m probably off on my math. I, I, I don’t even know. It’s been a couple years. But he said, “One uses 50 million gallons of water a day.” I, I don’t have any im- I have no context for how much water that is. You know, as all these new subdivisions go in and everybody’s on well and septic and they’re, they’re pulling groundwater, you know, that’s one thing that we’re concerned about. But then when you throw in a user that, you know, may use who knows how much water a day and, and you really don’t know, it’s like what’s that gonna do to us? You know, just for us as a, as a resident or us as a small farm who, who uses some from time to time to irrigate, you know- Yep … when, when things are tight. This is a, this is a really, really, really pathetic little example, okay? But a friend of mine who lives just down the road, years ago, uh, the road that he was on, you know, there were four or five homes on it. There was not a, a gas line on that road, and Northeast Ohio came in and said, “Hey, we can run gas here,” yada, yada, yada. Mm-hmm. And Isaac and his family chose to hook on, you know, to, you know, to put, you know, to put, uh, you know, the money forward to, you know, to tie into it. There was a farmer up the road who had a chicken house, and he tied in as well. And when it got cold that next winter, the chicken house pulled so much gas from the line that Isaac and his family didn’t have heat every so often. Mm-hmm. Because it would get cold, and he would suck all the gas out of the line. Yeah. And it didn’t leave anything for the rest of the, you know, four or five, you know, six homes on that stretch of road. Again, that’s a pathetically small little example. Mm. But it’s e- it’s exactly what you’re talking about. You, you have this giant user- Mm-hmm … that’s taking this, let’s use the 50 million gallons again as an example. That, that, that, that, that is just a- amazingly huge. It may seem like a small example, but it’s not a small example to that, that homeowner- Yeah … who’s cold. You’re exactly right. So- You’re exactly right … so no, it, it is important. A-and those are kind of things that we’re running into. And, and if you look at the, the news around Columbus, I, I think Sunbury just passed a moratorium within the last few days on- Really? … on a data center development. Um, currently right now, um, if you look on the west side of Columbus, um, I know at one po- I don’t know if it’s still in effect, but, uh, Jerome Township in Union County, um, they had a moratorium a-and that’s the Dublin area. And then, um, I believe Washington Township, which is the township that, you know, the main township for Dublin- Mm-hmm … you know, the unincorporated areas, um, they have concerns. And, and so then you look at what’s going on in Hilliard a-and the fuel cell discussion of their township fire department, Norwich Township, which provides fire to both the township and to Hilliard, um, they’re super concerned because they don’t even know how they’re gonna fight a chemical fire, you know, with these fuel cells because they don’t have enough information. So they’re concerned a-and wanting information. So a-again, it all goes back to just the unknown. It’s like, are there good things with data centers? Abso- absolutely. If you’re looking at it from the economic development side and what it does for us day to day, you know, you could say, “Yeah, these are good things.” But then, you know, depending on who you’re getting your information from, you know, sometimes- Yeah … sometimes the truth is stretched to, to make a point. So, you know, how much in terms of employment do these data centers make? You know, depending on where you get your information, it can vary widely. Um, I know in general, you know, you have these huge data center complexes and, and they normally have a very small permanent staff that’s there. Mm-hmm. But then at the same time, you know, because they’re doing work on the s- the server racks or making changes, you know, swapping equipment out, you may have contractors that come in and out all the time. And then you’ve got the side of it of, well then, you know, when you build one of these centers, it creates a huge amount of employment because of the construction, but that’s temporary. So- Right … you know, how do you, how do you weigh all of these things against, you know, somebody that wants to do, you know, a manufacturing facility or some other kind of industrial use? It, it, it’s kind of open to interpretation. I don’t, I don’t think, you know, what you see out there, you know, in the news or o- on the web, you know, as far as, you know, reports and studies, I don’t k- know really what is true and what isn’t true at this point because you got both sides kind of inflating the arguments. Right.